Sour dough starter - help

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Sour dough starter - help

Postby tezza » October 31st, 2013, 7:33 pm

I have never been much of a baker, or indeed a bread maker. But watched a bit of this evening's repeat on BBC2 of Great British Bake Off and was thoroughly intrigued when Paul Hollywood showed how to make a starter for sour dough bread.

I have to try making this at home!

But I have to admit I am a bit daunted. :oops: Not sure why.

I could Google, or even dig out a cookery book or two from upstairs, probably will do both actually, but love to learn from the experts on here and would love your thoughts, comments, tips, recipes, uses for sour dough bread, anything on the subject would be most welcome.

Thanks in advance. :hug:
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Re: Sour dough starter - help

Postby aero280 » November 1st, 2013, 12:16 am

I keep intending to do sourdough, but I keep going away for a week or more.
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Re: Sour dough starter - help

Postby dennispc » November 1st, 2013, 7:48 pm

tezza, I felt like you, Paulthebread gave me some starter and I've spent a couple of years making sourdoughs. The experts make it difficult, more so because for every million people making it, there seem to be the same number of recipes. I stopped in the summer (its too complicated to explain) but plan to make my own starter in a couple of weeks, using yoghurt in the starter rather than the grapes.

I suggest you follow the programme and see how you get on - keep notes so you can post if you need to. Give it a go, learn by doing. 100g of starter is roughly equivalent to a rounded tsp of dried yeast. Please don't ask me questions about hydration and percentages, I'm very poor at maths. :oops:

aero280 wrote:I keep intending to do sourdough, but I keep going away for a week or more.


Not a problem. As an experiment once I put 100 gms in a lidded jar and left it in the fridge for a month and it revived.
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Re: Sour dough starter - help

Postby dennispc » November 1st, 2013, 10:07 pm

tezza, I've just watched last night's recording - Halloween got in the way. My reference to grapes may have confused you as PH used apple last night - in his book 'Bread' he uses grapes.

The following is something I typed up for a friend of Paul's - it may help.

The following recipe I’ve tweaked from Hugh Fernley-Whittingstall’s River Cottage Every Day. We want fresh bread at lunch time, so this is what I do most days.

1. First thing in the morning refresh starter, leave on side.

2. After a couple of hours - mix 100gs active starter, 250gs of bread flour (white, brown, whatever) and 275gs water. Cover, leave on the side.

3. At some time in the evening, add about 1 tbs of oil, olive, rapeseed, whatever, stir in, add 300g bread flour and about 5g of fine salt and mix together.

4. Turn the dough out onto an oiled surface, knead with oiled hands, form into a ball. Place in a lightly oiled bowl ensuring dough has oil all over it. If you cover with a plastic bag it shouldn’t stick, leave on the side overnight.

5. First thing the following morning, knock back, fold and shape. Prove in a proving basket or oiled loaf tin, cover, let it rise for 1.5 to 3 hours. Mine usually takes about 2 hours.

Heat oven to 250C if possible. Preheat a baking tray if you have one, dust it with flour, place loaf on it - bake for 15 minutes, turn oven down to 200C for about 30 minutes but do check, some ovens run hotter.

Notes.

At 5 above when I tip out, I do a baker’s fold - Paul will explain - cover with bowl upside down and leave for ten minutes, carry on with shaping etc.

We want bread for sandwiches so most of the time I make a tin loaf. The dough is shaped, placed in an oiled and floured tin, when risen it goes into the hot oven. That makes it easy.

To shape in a basket, put the shaped dough in with the fold on top in order to tip out onto a floured hot baking tray and into the oven.

You can change the timings to suit yourself; make the sponge one evening, in the morning turn into dough, cover, leave on the side all day, shape later and bake.

Once I refreshed a starter around 4pm, made sponge around 6pm and into a dough about 9pm and baked the following morning. The experts wouldn’t approve but it made edible bread.

Unfortunately you can’t rush the final prove.

I use basic sunflower oil for lining bowl, tins and kneading. For the dough mix I tend to use a better olive oil.

A no knead method works - after the dough stage, roughly tidy it up, put in a tin and leave overnight, covered in the fridge. Following morning, heat oven and when up to temperature put tin in the oven.

Recently I was away for three weeks and my fridge starter refreshed as normal.

Any bread left over is sliced and put in the freezer though sourdough keeps better than yeast breads, I think.

I'm sure there will be plenty of variations. ;)
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Re: Sour dough starter - help

Postby dennispc » November 1st, 2013, 10:10 pm

dennispc wrote:tezza, I've just watched last night's recording - Halloween got in the way. My reference to grapes may have confused you as PH used apple last night - in his book 'Bread' he uses grapes.

The following is something I typed up for a friend of Paul's - it may help.

The following recipe I’ve tweaked from Hugh Fernley-Whittingstall’s River Cottage Every Day. We want fresh bread at lunch time, so this is what I do most days.

1. First thing in the morning refresh starter, leave on side.

2. After a couple of hours - mix 100gs active starter, 250gs of bread flour (white, brown, whatever) and 275gs water. Cover, leave on the side.

3. At some time in the evening, add about 1 tbs of oil, olive, rapeseed, whatever, stir in, add 300g bread flour and about 5g of fine salt and mix together.

4. Turn the dough out onto an oiled surface, knead with oiled hands, form into a ball. Place in a lightly oiled bowl ensuring dough has oil all over it. If you cover with a plastic bag it shouldn’t stick, leave on the side overnight.

5. First thing the following morning, knock back, fold and shape. Prove in a proving basket or oiled loaf tin, cover, let it rise for 1.5 to 3 hours. Mine usually takes about 2 hours.

Heat oven to 250C if possible. Preheat a baking tray if you have one, dust it with flour, place loaf on it - bake for 15 minutes, turn oven down to 200C for about 30 minutes but do check, some ovens run hotter.

Notes.

At 5 above when I tip out, I do a baker’s fold cover with bowl upside down and leave for ten minutes, carry on with shaping etc.

We want bread for sandwiches so most of the time I make a tin loaf. The dough is shaped, placed in an oiled and floured tin, when risen it goes into the hot oven. That makes it easy.

To shape in a basket, put the shaped dough in with the fold on top in order to tip out onto a floured hot baking tray and into the oven.

You can change the timings to suit yourself; make the sponge one evening, in the morning turn into dough, cover, leave on the side all day, shape later and bake.

Once I refreshed a starter around 4pm, made sponge around 6pm and into a dough about 9pm and baked the following morning. The experts wouldn’t approve but it made edible bread.

Unfortunately you can’t rush the final prove.

I use basic sunflower oil for lining bowl, tins and kneading. For the dough mix I tend to use a better olive oil.

A no knead method works - after the dough stage, roughly tidy it up, put in a tin and leave overnight, covered in the fridge. Following morning, heat oven and when up to temperature put tin in the oven.

Recently I was away for three weeks and my fridge starter refreshed as normal.

Any bread left over is sliced and put in the freezer though sourdough keeps better than yeast breads, I think.

I'm sure there will be plenty of variations. ;)
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Re: Sour dough starter - help

Postby dennispc » November 1st, 2013, 10:12 pm

Obviously, I clicked the Quote button instead of the Edit one. :oops:
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Re: Sour dough starter - help

Postby suffolk » March 21st, 2018, 12:26 pm

Recent references to sourdough starters on Cbox, and the fact that since the farm shop closed it's harder for us to get 'real' sourdough as opposed to what I think is a sort of inauthentic 'taste-alike' supermarket version, I've been reading this thread and doing some googling ... what do experienced sourdough makers think of this method of creating a sourdough starter ... it seems relatively clear and straightforward compared to some things I've read

https://www.permaculture.co.uk/readers- ... gh-starter
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Re: Sour dough starter - help

Postby dennispc » March 21st, 2018, 2:39 pm

Looks good to me Suffolk - I warm to anyone who's not strict about temperature and keeps things simple.

I use a screw top kilner jar - just happen to have one.

Last starter I made was just organic wholegrain spelt and water.

All the best.
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Re: Sour dough starter - help

Postby suffolk » March 21st, 2018, 2:48 pm

dennispc wrote:Looks good to me Suffolk - I warm to anyone who's not strict about temperature and keeps things simple.

I use a screw top kilner jar - just happen to have one.

Last starter I made was just organic wholegrain spelt and water.

All the best.


That was my thought Dennis ... I like keeping things simple :D

We have a visitor this weekend, but next week I should have time to focus on this .........
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Re: Sour dough starter - help

Postby Herbidacious » March 21st, 2018, 3:10 pm

I am still finding bits of (hard dry) sour dough starter about a year after I ended my relationship with mine :)
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Re: Sour dough starter - help

Postby scullion » March 21st, 2018, 4:39 pm

i think i started mine off with rye flour but i'm not sure it really matters as long as it's not bleached white stuff!
this is the starter recipe that i used - i think it may be even easier than the method you used for measuring purposes.
mine had a lovely apple-ey smell when it was fermenting right.

there are a couple of other 'pre-ferments' that use ordinary yeast . the biga - an italian version, and the poolish - originaly polish and now used in most french breads.
you may want to have a play with those while you're waiting for your sourdough starter to be useable!
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