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Wildfood.info • View topic - Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Order yourself a latte, and a pastry (The virtual cinnamon buns are excellent today). And have a nice chat.

Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby earthmaiden » February 19th, 2020, 7:43 pm

https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/ ... ukhpmglife

I have nothing against vegans but in my workplace there weren't separate fridges for any dietary requirement whether, ethical, religious or anything else. It could be said that employers should raise the bar so that they all are catered for of course and I'm sure this would be welcomed now that we live in such diverse communities.

I always took my food in a cool bag with an ice pack which was adequate for a 12 hour shift (so thankfully avoided the communal fridge :scared: ).No good for shift workers working away from home who brought in enough to last 4 days or so though.
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby Herbidacious » February 19th, 2020, 8:20 pm

Goodness. As a long standing vegetarian, it would never occur to me to request such a thing even if I wanted it (and there were room for it.) It seems very precious, entitled and self-centred.

They'll be asking people to not eat meat in the same room next, and refusing to do the tea round for non-vegans?

Work happily supplies all mannar of vegan milks.
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby scullion » February 20th, 2020, 12:50 am

i think i would draw the line at wanting to share (and therefore be expected to share the cleaning) of a 'fridge if someone had dripping meat or fish (of any state). the smell would be more than enough to put me off using it anyway - i'd rather eat a pot noodle and drink black coffee!
but i'm not an ethical vegan. if people are prepared to or can kill their own meat i think they have the right to eat it.
i don't know where the line is drawn for ethical vegans - what about standing next to someone with a tweed jacket or silk blouse? - it must make tube travel a nightmare!
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby northleedsbhoy » February 20th, 2020, 7:38 am

The fridges we had at work were for the use of everyone and the majority used them and I worked with vegans and vegetarians and no one complained about what was stored in them. The fridges were cleaned by the cleaners weekly on a Friday and everything left was thrown out, which was a bit of a pain for those working overtime at the weekend who had forgotten to clearly mark their milk etc that it was not to be thrown away.

Personally I’m a meat eater but I know a lot of people and friends who are vegan/vegetarian and even they think that vegans are taking things a bit too far with some of the demands that they are making - for example a small company of 10 employees where one is vegan and who demands their own fridge would be an added unwelcome cost to the employer.

As you say scully how do ethical vegans get to work and how do they work with their non-vegan colleagues? Will the next step be to demand their own workspace? Folks have the right to decide their own lifestyle but when their demands start to impact on others chosen lifestyle then it may be time to draw a line in the sand.

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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby Herbidacious » February 20th, 2020, 8:12 am

Why would the fridge be dripping meat or fish though?
Most work fridges contain lunches to be eaten that day or ingredients bought that day to take home. This is not how it works out, of course. Periodically, one particular person sends round angry, indignant emails about smells emanating from the fridge (to be fair she sits next to one) as stuff is going mouldy. But the finger cannot be pointed at any particular food group (or indeed person, it seems...)
I don't know if anyone ever cleans our fridges :o I think only if we request it. Our cleaners' job is just to vacuum, I think wipe down desks very occasionally - not really supposed to touch our desks - and wash mugs and glasses.
The only other gripe is people microwaving very smelly fishy things. Again, an annoyance for everyone, regardless of diet.
I am an 'ethical' vegetarian (although I realize I am not ethical enough now...) I don't like confrontation so I have spent more than 30 years assiduously being very low profile about it. There is a breed of meat eaters who can be very antagonistic towards our, one assumes, presumed silent moral disapprobation towards them.

And I thought all young folk (for this is, really who we are talking about?) were moral relativists anyway. (= anyone can have the moral opinion they want as long as it doesn't bother me...?!)
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby icelesley » February 20th, 2020, 8:26 am

We had a small fridge at work just two shelves, to be used by six of us, so each had there food in a bag with their name on so no cross contamination, you just had to put your bag where it would fit. Nobody complained. Mind you it was me and five men, say no more. :rolleyes:
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby earthmaiden » February 20th, 2020, 8:53 am

Our large fridge plus a smaller one was shared by the whole floor, some day and some shift workers, probably over 50 people. They got very full and did smell and drip sometimes, they were cleaned out on Fridays with anything out of date or not labelled as 'in use' thrown away. That was why I took my own cool bag, it wasn't nice. It would have made sense for each area to have had a small fridge in the office but this was not allowed. We had a mix of cultures (Muslim, Jewish, Hindu etc) plus vegans, vegetarians, intolerances. I don't think it would be fair to single out just vegans from that mix but think it raises an interesting point in 21st British society as to whether our traditional stance is 'right' if everyone is to be respected.
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby dennispc » February 20th, 2020, 10:16 am

Interesting last sentence EM. Food for thought.

At the moment the separation advice is from a non-statuary body, following a court ruling for someone who wanted their beliefs given the status of a religion. Therefore it has no status.
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby Herbidacious » February 20th, 2020, 12:31 pm

Drippiness is horrid no matter what the source.

Last sentence is an expression of moral relativism? A huge philosophical topic.

Without going into it (much) surely you can't respect all values if they are conflicting? But it sounds like the fridge thing is about not offending people rather than truly respecting their beliefs, so maybe that's ok, if you think you should avolid offending people. Truly respecting their beliefs would surely involve prohibiting meat (non kosher, no halal etc.) in the work place altogether...? Which I was going to say should be ok, as meat eating isn't a religious thing, but according to a BBC article, that's not true, as some Muslims think it's a duty to eat meat. (Albeit maybe not at every meal.)

It's a minefield...
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby earthmaiden » February 20th, 2020, 12:54 pm

If you ban meat you are taking away the rights of meat eaters ;).
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby Badger's mate » February 20th, 2020, 1:27 pm

I used to work in a traditional manufacturing industry. When I started the workforce were mostly white working class people from the vicinity of the works, as indeed was I. My eating habits were variously a source of amusement, mockery, astonishment and disgust. On at least one occasion it was suggested that (I paraphrase) ' that bespectacled fellow in the laboratory should be sent home', due to my recent consumption of garlic. I was quite happy to wind them up in those days. Perhaps nowadays I would have to be more careful. Garlic wouldn't be a problem of course, but giblets, pigs' trotters or jellied eels might.
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby Herbidacious » February 20th, 2020, 1:36 pm

Rights and respect for vampires! Badger's mate :)
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby Badger's mate » February 20th, 2020, 2:08 pm

Funnily enough, I never encountered any vampires. My diet must have worked. :D
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby wargarden » February 20th, 2020, 2:08 pm

But what about rights of the lunch thief.
don't they have a right to a variety of lunch
choices to steal. No one ever steals the vegans
lunch since they usually unpalatable to anyone
but another vegan. what this type
thing will cause is the elimination of
fridge completely.

where I work the lunch thief caused everyone to bring
there own cooler, thermos or Mr bento.


also do vegan need there own microwaves.
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby Seatallan » February 20th, 2020, 3:03 pm

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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby scullion » February 20th, 2020, 4:11 pm

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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby earthmaiden » February 20th, 2020, 5:41 pm

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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby Rainbow » February 20th, 2020, 11:51 pm

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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby suffolk » February 21st, 2020, 7:49 am

In our student house we allocated shelves ... the only veggie had the top shelf and kept most of his stuff in Tupperware type boxes. The Jewish lad didn’t keep strict kosher and after a few weeks of feeding himself decided he was happy to let his RC girlfriend do all the cooking ... but she didn’t like cooking so they tended to live on filled naan breads. That left Kate and myself. Kate hardly ate anything during the week as she disliked sharing a kitchen and filled herself up at weekends when she stayed with the rich boyfriend in Cambridge ... I ate mainly jacket potatoes or made a batch of soup at the weekend and lived on that.
There was a fair amount of give and take needed and I got a large roll of sticky labels so my food was easily identified.
The bigger problems arose from the vegetarian trying to smuggle his underwear into other people’s loads of washing as he could never afford detergent. :rolleyes:
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby Herbidacious » February 21st, 2020, 8:39 am

I was truly shocked when I went to university and people stole my cheese.
In a shared house a few years later, we had a house mate who would steel cheese and leave the empty container in the fridge. She's the one who promised to feed our cat when we went away for a week, and as soon as we'd gone, put her outside for the week leaving the food in the garden. We'd not had the cat long and she'd come to us for shelter when poorly, so she could have left again...
Nasty woman also used to have her boyfriend almost permanently living with us. (Not contributing anything.) She thought it was wrong to move in with someone before you got married :shock: My good judge of character radar failed me when we let he move in with us. Can you tell I have not really forgiven her?!
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby Seatallan » February 21st, 2020, 9:17 am

Can't say I blame you Herbi. If anyone did that to our cat I'd probably kill them. :evil:
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby earthmaiden » February 21st, 2020, 9:37 am

Strange set of moral values there!
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby WWordsworth » February 21st, 2020, 11:23 am

My student flatmate would drink all the (shared) coffee and NEVER replace it.
She loathed tea, I like it so I switched to tea.
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby Herbidacious » February 21st, 2020, 11:38 am

I am not sure I could share a house with a non-partner now. A couple of years ago, I was asked by an old friend if she could come and live with me for a an unspecified amount of time after she finished her post grad degree, while she looked for a job in London (and had no income.) Of course I said yes, but was very worried about it. In the end, she got a job that came with a house in the countryside :) But perhaps it would have been nice to have her around. Husband was still in Germany at this point. (My worry is no slight on the friend. Just the idea of sharing living space... :shock: )
Another friend has been taking in lodgers since her son left home. She feeds them too! Although actually that might be more work, that might be better, as you hvea more control. (... over your kitchen!)
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby suffolk » February 21st, 2020, 11:44 am

A friend once said that although she loved her husband (and she really did) she sometimes would prefer it if he lived next door and had to knock
When he came into ‘her space’ :D
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby Herbidacious » February 21st, 2020, 11:50 am

Ah yes, I can sympthaize with that. As long as he doesn't come and mess up my space as well as his.
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby earthmaiden » February 21st, 2020, 2:45 pm

I had student lodgers when DD went to uni, DS was still at home.The first was quite fun but the next one was awful, he didn't do anything wrong but was just a PITA. I've had a couple of other lodgers too. I was used to people around then as DS had friends round all the time day and night, I'd hate it now, having people to stay for a few days is quite enough! I think an OH only really works well if you have plenty of space. When MIL was in sheltered accommodation, one husband and wife had a flat each, next door to each other! I can see that working well as one gets older ;).
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby WWordsworth » February 21st, 2020, 4:47 pm

One chap I used to work with got married in his 40s.
Husband and wife maintained separate households during the week.
Much as I love J I can see the attraction.
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby suffolk » February 22nd, 2020, 8:09 am

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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby earthmaiden » February 22nd, 2020, 8:34 am

:lol:
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby Herbidacious » February 22nd, 2020, 10:24 am

Ah they missed Veganuary so obviously they can't go vegan now...

It goes without saying that most people behind the vegan 'revolution' on food stuffs are in it for the money. However as the article points out it's the "...when people take a stand, and are caught out not doing what they profess to live and die by..." that's problematic here.
No one likes hypocrisy or disingenuity.
Although I suspect they were investigated because a lot of people don't like vegans... (i.e. the journalist might also be exhibitiing a bit of disingenuity, here.)
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby StokeySue » February 22nd, 2020, 12:11 pm

I never had a lot if trouble with fridges apart from when a mouse got in and ate only one thing - the perfect apple my house mate, a trainee illustrator, was keeping to use in a picture

The sink though :terrified: , people would dump used dishes and pots and leave them for days, I challenged one and he said if they were in the sink then obviously they weren’t in my way. He seemed quite surprised when I pointed out that in fact I used the sink nearly every time I went into the kitchen, including for veg prep
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby WWordsworth » February 22nd, 2020, 12:20 pm

J had a housemate like that.
He flipped one night when the pots had been there for a few days.
He loaded everything into the washing up bowl and dumped it on the offender's bed.

Offender was in bed at the time.
He did see the error of his ways.
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby KC2 » February 22nd, 2020, 12:25 pm

A propos kitchen hygiene, did any of you happen to see this on the BBC website today :lol: https://www.bbc.co.uk/food/articles/kitchen_hygiene

When one of my sons was in a shared house his first year at uni the kitchen really had to be seen to be believed :sprout: :sprout:
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby StokeySue » February 22nd, 2020, 1:04 pm

Never impressed by articles that talk about “germs”, how very 20th century :lol:

Seriously, I’m sure all the recommendations are sensible, but the failure to distinguish between bacteria of all kinds and pathogens (disease causing bacteria) is a bit confused

One thing that always annoys me on TV is people putting food into the fridge uncovered - even if you are one of those people who are totally blasé about bacterial cross-contamination, if you put an uncovered dish of marinating meat into the fridge, you will end up with garlic scented milk for your tea, so why do most TV cooks do it?
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby karadekoolaid » February 22nd, 2020, 4:05 pm

" Bite off more than you can chew, then chew like Hell!"
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby suffolk » February 22nd, 2020, 4:22 pm

Oh yes KK there are now vegan wines and beers without any animal-derived finings etc

I’ve also read that the Vegan Society are also suggesting that non-leather safety harness/rescue equipment should be available for them ... are they really going to send their rescuers back to base for fresh equipment when they arrive to rescue them using non-vegan equipment ... ? :shock:

Without wishing to upset anyone, and while I’m perfectly fine with folk choosing to eat what they will; what I simply don’t understand is how such extreme vegans cope with the knowledge that their cats and dogs are eating meat and that in fact most of nature is based upon ‘eat or be eaten’. I just don’t understand the moral premise.
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby earthmaiden » February 22nd, 2020, 5:19 pm

I thought that some pets were fed a non-meat diet by owners who preferred not to have it in the house. There has been discussion on whether or not it is suitable for dogs and cats etc in the media before.
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby suffolk » February 22nd, 2020, 5:41 pm

Personal preference I understand. What I don’t get is the folk I’ve come across elsewhere who declare eating meat to be ‘wrong/immoral’. :? One of those people said that it is immoral for shepherds to use sheepdogs and make them ‘work’ and for anyone to ride or drive a horse.
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby Gruney » February 22nd, 2020, 6:18 pm

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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby StokeySue » February 22nd, 2020, 6:23 pm

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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby suffolk » February 22nd, 2020, 6:24 pm

That was my response to him Gruney ... suffice to say it turned out that the chap in question had very little experience of animals as he had grown up without pets ... his parents believed that ‘owning’ animals was also immoral. :cry:
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby Herbidacious » February 22nd, 2020, 7:24 pm

As long as there is something vegan/vegetarian that is proven to be ok for cats and dogs to eat that's ok, but even if someone - especially one of these dodgy millennial start up companies - the type that promote 'reusable tissues' as the new best environmentally great thing - I would still be suspicious. We have to bear in mind in all of this that those pushing products are basically trying to make money.
Mind you, a vet at the place we go to has described Felix and Whiskas and the like as the Macdondalds of cat food. i.e. not exactly healthy. So it's not clear that we can really trust well known brands either.
Our pets don't have a choice and it would be idiotic and, ironically, possibly immoral, to inflict one's moral views on them given that they are, well, cats and dogs.
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby karadekoolaid » February 22nd, 2020, 9:11 pm

" Bite off more than you can chew, then chew like Hell!"
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby miss mouse » February 22nd, 2020, 10:18 pm

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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby earthmaiden » February 22nd, 2020, 10:23 pm

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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby miss mouse » February 22nd, 2020, 10:29 pm

Yuk. Do not remind me. I have never had that delightful laundering task but the Ma did.

Bicarbonate of soda dissolves mucus I believe, perhaps a soak in that first. I feel quite ill now.

And then there is the environmental cost of cotton production, harvesting, manufacturing, shipping. Hmm, not quite that simple this stuff is it.
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby earthmaiden » February 22nd, 2020, 11:45 pm

I inherited so many from elderly relatives I would never need to buy new ones! I saved all the prettiest, the sort that my Sunday School teacher used to say were 'for show, not for blow' :lol:.
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby dennispc » February 23rd, 2020, 12:49 pm

Every day is a good day, it's just that some days are better than others.
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Re: Work Fridges - what is reasonable?

Postby dennispc » February 23rd, 2020, 1:06 pm

Should‘ve added, don’t shoot the messenger! Just trying to explain some things. Now I will enjoy my cold beef sandwich for lunch.
Every day is a good day, it's just that some days are better than others.
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